You dont seem to understand. CCP does not have the coding skills to pull off WIS. That is what it comes down to.
Just look at how lousy our toons look walking around in CQ.

If they do it, it will suck.

I suspect that is the other reason why WoD was canned.

I hope you don't want to be taken seriously.


They need the money beforehand,
not afterwards.

You mean people like the ones they just laid off sent to the True Death in Atlanta?

Having a bunch of devs working on "something" without a plan or a clue is a waste of resources. CCP still has no plan or clue how to do this. Maybe you should kickstart funding for some realistic and deliverable ideas first.

While not as passionate about hating WiS as some others here, I don-¦t think WiS would work just for the sake of showing off like in some other MMORGS.... Eve Online and its players simply do not operate this way.

That means you will need some content beyond some expanded, shared Captains-¦ Quarters, most importantly a way to interact with each other like you currently can outside of the stations. Which means CCP better start thinking about ways how someone who is Walking in Station can kill and be killed (something that the Devs rejected from the beginning, though, iirc). THEN you just might start getting some sympathy for WiS. Perhaps.
Also a way to evict someone forcefully from the station. Just think what that would mean to Jita local. Imagine a million scammers crying out in pain and suddenly fall silent.
Something to almost look forward to....

For the $5000 pledge level youll receive:

All of the benefits of the 500$ pledge level plus:

In game title of Rear Admiral

Rough napkin sketch of a Megathron having coitus with a crinkle cut French fry

1 5lb bag of Dominix models

One slightly moist used towelette salvaged from Hilmar's trash can

Hardcover of the upcoming best selling book "The Successful Voyages of Unsuccessful at Everything" incl bonus hardbound copy of "The Office Diaries"

1 Unsuccessful at Everything's Velator complete with 1 trit and Civilian Electron Blaster and Civilian Mining Laser

1 Unsuccessful at Everything corpse

and a medal of your choice awarded by The Troll Bridge

I admire the OP's enthusiasm, but would like to remind them that CCP will happily take their money and not deliver on promise.

The difference here is CCP is, you know, an actual games company. The reason your Day-Z's et al need funding ahead of time, is because it's much better for them (and the end user) for them to be able to self-release a title than it is to do so under the purview of a large publisher.

Pledge-rewards and all that gunk are stupid, however.

It's possible that they were able to run a stripped down version, Or a very buggy version, or maybe it was truly fnatastic and nearly complete. There is no way for us to know the quality of the prototypes they had/have. What we can know is that anything is achievable with the right team, time, and money. Nothing about WiS is unrealistic.

I for one think that with other games delving into avatar based VR gameplay, that it might be a motivator for CCP to continue working with the Oculus to expand into WiS gameplay. Maybe it'll be part of Dust on PC. Maybe it'll be part of Valkyrie which is already on the Oculus. Maybe they'll bring it to EVE. Maybe it will be it's own game altogether. When CCP see's the right opportunity they will work on it. It's too big of an idea to abandon simply because the demographic for EVE isn't entirely on board. Not all games are aimed at the same demographic.

I expected the thread to get locked because it's not the approved WiS ghetto that you're supposed to post this crap in.

Eve is actually in fairly good shape now that they are actually putting effort into it. The ship rebalancing has been fantastic...seeing ships that have been in the game forever actually being used is great.

Sov is kind of borked but Goons are making it work for us and our people in the CSM feel good about the future but there is obviously a lot of work to be done before they could ever go back to wasting time on roleplayer foolishness.

That's not how economics works.

What exactly are you asking for?

Clearly, not just walking around in stations as that would get boring fast.

I can see value in combining some form of WiS with exploration of old/abandoned outposts and stations. That could be interesting.

However, purely in terms of WiS in populated stations, what services and capabilities do you want and how will they improve what is already there, or what new possibilities are you looking for?

'Art' is only a timesink once you have a working game. They do **not** have the engine, this is specifically why there is no chance of it happening.

Did a NPC corp alt really just pull a "your opinion doesn't count because of the character you posted on". You do see the irony of that right?

Hmm...

500 pounds towards a feature that is not planned, currently does not exist, and is thus far theoretical.

OP, did you by chance back Star Citizen?

For which they need money...and you won't be giving it until its done....which is not going to happen....

They did, they had a lot of it working in a prototype form in the Unreal engine.
See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8sfaN8zT8E
If you contrast that to WoD, where at Fanfest 2013 they talked in vague terms about the future capabilities of the engine and showed some devs getting excited that they have several tools in place to create in-world objects, you see the gulf between the two.

You will note I am not calling CCP incompetent here, I am merely stressing the level of work involved in getting their vision of WiS working vs the Eve-O commentators "just re-use the dust code!" mentality. Be clear: it was CCP's intention to spend the next several expansion cycles after incarna (so, maybe about now) on full-time development of WiS. It took just over two years full-time development to get a version of CQ ready to ship that was so poor it nearly destroyed CCP (and definitely did destroy multiple computers).

If you want to go the next few years leaving
- Still a sub-par NPE
- Terrible PVE across all areas
- FW in need of a re-visit
- A sov system so bad every entity plays around it as much as possible
- POSes that make people want to kill themselves
- No ship balancing
- No new ships
- No new artwork of any kind
- No new whatever they are doing with buildable stargates
- Work on completing V3 / new shaders
- No work on server / game performance

So that you can
- Walk into a 'casino' and be done 5minutes later

then by all means, continue to petition for development on WiS.

The rest of us who actually play with spaceships in this spaceship game don't want CCP to abandon what we all subscribed to, to cater for people still left with a hole to fill when Second Life succumbed to furries.

Was it all before your time, when GD was full of people saying "How about this?" and CCP replying "Maybe in 2-3 years"? People didn't rebel over Incarna because they didn't like walking in stations, they rebelled over Incarna because no work had happened on the (then very badly broken) core game in years because of it, and it was very clear the game wouldn't survive long enough to see the completion of the work unless CCP turned around on it.
Hillmar has said the same thing, in different words.

This thread demonstrates how much activity can be generated by nothing. Humans like to call themselves "intelligent". Frankly, I don't see it. I've seen sheep make better sense than this. Could someone please explain why this behavior is so prevalent in a species that has supposedly conquered all manner of things...space...uh...space...uh...Oh...I see.

That's how bad a state CCP was in at the time. They realized they only had time to finish a single room before Incarna went live and they decided to pick the one that looks like a third world prison cell.

We should all be thankful that CCP learned from their mistakes.

Marketingspeak for "sorry you got so pissed off at our idiocy. You shouldn't get so pissed off next time."

Also, that post is entirely out of date and out of context. It doesn't take into account Hillmar's "sorry this has screwed up our company so bad we have to fire 1/3 of our employee's" post, or his "sorry I screwed up EVE, the most responsible thing I can do now is to promote another lead dev to take care of EVE while I do the business stuff.". Last update from the current lead dev is a "no, we're not working on it, no we aren't planning on working on it, no we don't know what we'll do with it if we ever start working on it again."

Space-barbie is dead. Let it rest in peace. Stop violating it's necrotic corpse. Even beginning work on a replacement for it within the next 3 or 4 years (or however long it takes to finish the current development goals) would be an extremely stupid direction for the company.

Sorry but CCP words look to me completely in context. Nothing in EVE is out of date. What happened is history and has a record which can be recalled. The position on space barbie might have changed, but sorry to say that you cannot erase what has been said.

I'd give $200 to help fund it.

They really should do a kickstarter to gauge interest, I bet there are quite a few people that would post money to make this happen.

And why aren't you quoting CCP Seagull? You know, the dev boss? That quote where she said they aren't doing it. They aren't planning on doing it. They aren't planning on planning on doing it.

CCP Seagull's development plan is probably the best plan CCP's had since the very beginning of EVE. Who are we kidding? It's the only meaningful plan they've ever had as a company. If space-barbie ever has a place in the development plan again, I'm convinced Seagull will make sure it happens at the right time. It sure as hell won't be within the next 2 or so years, because there's still too much broken stuff that actually matters.

Negative, I didn't pay much attention to Fanfest.

Perhaps my real error though is using the term "WiS".

We all know the "WiS" project is dead right now. When I say WiS I really mean avatar gameplay in general.

So judging by what I -have- heard from Fanfest, and the multitude of avatar-threads popping up since filled with excited players, I'd say the avatar dream is alive and well - just probably not in stations.

I've been here since beta and I think they do a fine job adding new content to the game. It's hardly recognizable from the beta days. Sure we all want more, but it's much easier to ask for more then it is to provide it in any balanced fashion.

I don't think creating a kickstarter would cost CCP much, and if we get WiS out of it that would be amazing. Even if the kickstarter flops perhaps there could be other ideas floated for a kickstarter.. things people in Eve want but that simply cost too much to tackle or require dedicated resources. (take a look at the ideas and suggestions form, there is no end to interesting ideas people have for this game.)

I don't understand why you people are so bent on adding avatar gameplay to EVE. The question I ask that never gets answered: what do you think avatars will actually add to the game? Why should your average player use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? Why should your specialist player (industrialist, corp leadership, wh) use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? You're asking CCP to shunt a lot of development time and effort to a feature with no stated purpose (other than some RP bull).

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.

Exactly... but as I already said, after this fanfest I'm inclined to give them time for now, at least, right now, it looks like they could be going back to avatar gameplay at one point in the future.

It might possibly be because 4000 people is not even 1% of EVE accounts.

Just like a dozen vocal and persistent form posters is not a majority, neither are the sum total of all players attending fanfest.

For WiS to work properly, and for it to be 'interesting' and 'big' enough to be a major part of the EVE univers you are essentially asking CCP to develop another game.

- It would need to run on a different engine

- It has completely different movement / controls / graphics / content that EVE already has.

CCP have shown us that they cant build this (WoD)

Captains Quarters is not even close to starting the process, its just one avatar walking around a single graphical box. Even that melted some peoples graphic cards.

Also you are asking them to develop this new game and add it to EVE, not sell it as a new game. Where are they going to make all their money on it. Microtransactions? $1000 Japanese Boutique Jeans?



Would I like so see a fully realized WiS experience in EVE --- Yes i guess so.

Do I think it would bring enough extra people to EVE to make is financially viable to CCP --- probably not.

DUST is also a failure.

And what do you do with those jeans? put them on your internet spaceship? Think......
It all revolved around WiS, it was the catalyst for everything going wrong. Wasted dev time to implement it and the intention to micro transaction it into oblivion. Don't get stuck on one issue subjects, it was many issues and all part of a whole, and revolving around WiS.

The problem is that the definition of "meaningful interaction" from the WiS fetishists is kind of scary. Roleplayers are horrible people and we don't want CCP catering to them.

That's only because SC is vaporware.

I'm not sure why the people who don't want WiS in the game see game development in such a high contrast black and white. Most of them - if not all - simply states that if WiS gets into the game, it definitely going to steal ALL resources from the core gameplay and it will instantly ruin everything by making people not even want to sit in their ships anymore - this despite the fact that Hilmar explicitly stated that the only way he would only allow WiS to ever come to life if it leaves the core game experience untouched.

I don't understand why would it be so unacceptable if CCP would have only a handful of people working on WiS (instead of hundreds), while the vast majority of developers would still carry on improving the core gameplay. Yeah sure, it would take much much longer to deliver that content - if ever - but the point is that this way it would have no impact on the inernet spaceships part of EVE - as even I personally would love to WiS in the game someday, I don't want to CCP to diverge in any way off their core values.

It's about reiteration but they have been working on new stuff. Player built gates and uncharted solar systems, deep space exploration etc. Part of the five year plan. Reiteration and maintenance mode are two different things. You don't see all the new stuff going in or something? Only a Jita 4-4 doubler would miss it all. Or someone that just logs in once a month to update the skill que.

It's one of the things that makes this discussion a mess, a lot of the terms either have double meanings (such as the case with Carbon), or different implications when spoken by different people (for example, to some WiS means the Incarna interpretation of avatar play, while others use it to mean any and all future avatar gameplay in EvE), which can cause two people with fairly similar views to argue for pages.

Personally, I believe there is a future for Avatar play in a different format, somewhere down the line, when the time is right, when there is a clear plan and purpose to it, and in a matter that doesn't screw EvE again. But I am adamant that the Incarna iteration is dead, shall remain dead, and anything using even elements of it should get two put in the back of the head, just to be sure.

Uh no, completely different. The FPS runs off Unreal Engine, it's an actual game. WiS is 'walking' the catwalk to show off all your Noble Exchange junk. As we know WiS or Carbon failed at anything really usable.

If its not spaceship related then my answer is no, if you want running around then go play Dust or wait for Legion, then you can do all the running around you want :P